Moral Dilemma: WWUD?

[STL]

Okay, I've been mulling over this for about a week now so let's see what others think. For those that don't know I play AFL (best. sport. ever.). And as w/ most contact sports things get a bit rough at times. Last weekend, one of my team mates, got cleaned up. The guy in the opposition team ran through his back and then threw his elbow into my mate's throat area and passed onto his jaw as he lost his footing. My mate went down and was out cold for 15 mins. The fat oversized brute who was about 6 foot 2, just laughed at it and called my mate a softc**k right in front of the ump. It was a sick, callous blow and the umpire said he didn't see anything - even though the hit was in the play and a man was down b/c of it. It's not really surprising anyway. The umpires were provided by the opposition (the home team) anyway (which is what usually happens).

The last quarter came around, and I chose my moment. No one did that to my mates. Any one of my team mates. After laying a shepard against the big oaf, I turned around in one fluid motion and swatted him one. He dropped like a fly. I told that was for the second quarter (where the 1st incident had happened) and re-entered the play w/out too much notice.

When the umpires realised what had happened, they weren't able to do anything. (He got up about 2 to 3 minute later and went off the ground to return about 10 minutes later.)The umpires never knew who did it but they said to our team after the game that stuff wasn't on. I was pretty pissed. It was a double standard. One of our boys gets put down, that's okay. Nothing major and they tell us to quit whining. One of their's gets done, they cry foul and have a sook. We're a much smaller team than them. Hell, I was at least a head shorter than the prick I smacked out.

Anyways, the coach didn't single me out but he knew what happened. Hell, most of the boys knew what happened. Most of the boys know why I did it and they appreciate what happened. It means we look after our own. However, me, I'm not so sure.

I do feel kind of bad. What I basically did was an eye for an eye. Is that right? So what would you have done? Did I make the right call?

[Pulse]

Any teammate who looks out for his other teammates would have done exactly the same thing.

Sure we don't play sport in the 70's anymore (where this was the norm) but if you were the one who copped the cheapshot, you don't think one of your teammates would have done exactly what you did?

STL, you did the right thing. :)

[Kyle]

The problem with most contact sports is that no system enforced by human judgements can ever be perfect. Realistically you have to go into the game expecting some unfairness could happen. The same of course goes for the other team. ;)

An eye for an eye is not nice. You've already felt bad about it, and at least you did it on the field not outside. :p Also you did it for your team mates and have the decency to reflect on what happened and question yourself whether you did the right thing. Something I doubt was on that brute's mind when he was laughing at your mate. (I hope you did knock some sense into him, and he would really learn from this.) Big difference. :) Also the umpires blamed your team for something that was caused by their own bad judgement. I hope they'll realise this soon, before someone gets seriously hurt. Not saying their wrongs made you right. But you did it with noble intention and it is already over, so don't feel bad about it at all. Your team mates are fortunate to have someone looking after them. :)

[roller]

ah football the game of savages


i was destined to play in a team till the racist coach said no

your team should beat that guys team up,unless your religiuous in which id say no

if your in melbourne get a contract out on this guy

violence is the only way

[Hereticpoo]

You are 100% right STL so don't feel guilty. This jerk is probably a bully outside of footy so I'm happy you smacked him one. I would have done the same thing. You're obviously a guy with a sense of honour, so everyone at your club owes you a beer for showing that your team are not spineless cats that can be bullied. Good Work! :cool:

[i_amtrunks]

Giant Neanderthals like that need to get some payback.

You did the right thing STL, even in full contact sports like AFL cheap shots are not on, and in the case of cheap shots, two wrongs do make a right, especially when the guy who made the first cheap shot is given an even better shot later on.

And giant wankers who take out female players (no matter how dirty the female players are) in mixed sports should be lined up and every opposition player given a free shot at the moron.

[Borgeman]

remind me to shake your hand :D

George

[sifun]

He got what he deserved.
Biased umpires should be shut from a game.

[Kyle]

You did the right thing STL, even in full contact sports like AFL cheap shots are not on, and in the case of cheap shots, two wrongs do make a right, especially when the guy who made the first cheap shot is given an even better shot later on.

:D

[iceburn]

remind me to shake your hand :D

George

i'll shake the other.
Empires that are not of neutral grounds are crap and it's lucky no one other than your team mates saw what happened :D

[Fungal Infection]

The only thing wrong about this incident is that you felt bad about it. :D

[kup]

The only thing wrong about this incident is that you felt bad about it. :D

QFT

I am a believer in making your own justice. If the law fails you in accomplishing it (the umpire) then there is nothing morally wrong with applying your own.

Its bad when it comes to artificially imposed social values but its the right thing to do when it comes to human values.

You have nothing bad to morally feel bad about, I would say its the complete opposite, you should be proud of not taking it as its handed to you and right a wrong even if you have to break existing rules.

[Rampage]

you did the right thing imo

you stood up for your teammate dont feel guilty feel good about yourself:)

all is fair on the football field

i headbutted an opposition players parent after a U/15's cricket game for racially slurring (aboriginal) one of my teammates repeatedly during the 2 day game (which we lost hey im a sore loser:D)

to this day i still have no remorse for that dick he got what was coming to him

as for my rugby behaviour i dunno where to start:p

[Robzy]

Hahaha... well done STL! :D

I don't play anymore, but I used to play Aussie Rules Footy (I agree... BEST sport EVA!) for years! I used to get pretty rough myself, but I never actually hit anyone though! I used to be that annoying "Mouth" from the opposition who would start verbal fights and sledge (like the Aussie Cricketers ;)) and have amusing put downs... basically I was the @$$hole the others wanted to hit... which was good coz they spent more time trying to fight me, rather than trying to stop me getting the ball :D

So, while I never hit anyone, I totally understand why you did... someone's got to fly the flag for a team mate who's been King Hit! :mad:

[roller]

STL let the hatred flow through you!

[Pulse]

STL let the hatred flow through you!

http://vtipy.netroof.eu/data/images/join-the-darkside.jpg:D

[STL]

In exciting news for many of u on the forum, I got taken out today. Had a blinder of a first half. Racked up 25 possessions then the opposition gave me a tag as well as some extra attention. :rolleyes:

Bloody sore as now. Barely even got thru a movie tonight before i decided to call it quits. My gf just left this morning and I was going to party the night out but I'm aching so badly, I'm sure I just got stepped on by Unicron.

What really peeved me off was I wasn't able to give the guy a whack back. I generally look out for myself pretty well but coach's orders were "keep ur head, don't be stupid". I ended up w/ like 4 possessions for the 2nd half... and a lot of bruises. I seriously wanted to %$# up my tagger. I copped a whack to the back of the head as I was getting up after a tackle but had no clue. Copped 3 to 4 punches to the chest as well as a few knees at my thighs from the opposition trying to give me corkies. :mad::mad::mad:

Or is this karma, I wonder? :rolleyes:

[TheDirtyDigger]

Goddam STL....you're making me feel nostalgic.
I really miss that Saturday night pain after a good game of footy.

[GoktimusPrime]

Okay... a player was injured and the umpires did nothing? Who's legally liable during these kinds of game when a person gets injured?

Are you actually playing for some kind of club or is it just some friendly teams that have assembled and decided to play? If it's the former, then I would imagine that there would be have to be some form of insurance in place and thus specific rules and legal ramifications. Who is responsible for player welfare/safety and was that person derelict in their duty? If so, then the person responsible could be charged for negligence. If not, then the club's insurance can cover for any medical costs incurred by the injury (if applicable). If it's the latter, then it falls under third party public liability, which means that the player who knocked out the other player is at fault.

That's how it works in martial arts anyway, so I'd imagine it would be the same for other sports too.

It's all fun and games until someone gets hurt and sues you. :)

[TheDirtyDigger]

Generally fights or violence on a football field (or any sporting field) are usually only dealt with by the appropriate association's tribunal (If at all. I got away with a lot of dirty $#!^ playing as a nasty backman). e.g. kidney punches in the pack, stomping on the full forwards hands with studs etc, etc.:o
But in extreme cases it can go to the constabulary. Our U17's captain at Red Hill ended up on assault charges for booting an opposition player in the face....a (large) number of times.:)
Insurance is a case for the association/league. Not for the club in question.

[STL]

I'm playing for a club and we do have insurance. I didn't have a serious injury, ie. broken ribs, concussion etc. Just got touched up a bit and that's a part of footy. I'm probably having the run of my life in the last 2 games I've played and I guess a tag and extra attention was due. A bit more than I'd normally but i was pretty banged up for most of today and bit tired and fatigued. But I'll live. :)

[Pulse]

See what happens when you choose to play that drivel of a game they call VFL... (or should that be AFL :rolleyes:)

[Borgeman]

Okay... a player was injured and the umpires did nothing? Who's legally liable during these kinds of game when a person gets injured?

in my opinion, this is the mindset that has caused such a rise in lawsuits/similar based on on field incidents. it most often comes from people who are not well versed in the real life playing of the sport, yet base their opinion on a few snippets they know of. (not directed at you gok, though i assume your knowledge on afl is not as great as say martial arts, and your playing experience is less again - please correct me if im wrong here :))

firstly, we are talking here about local footy, anythign in the national league should be disregarded as they are paid proffessionals.

afl is a rough contact sport, and injuries of varying degrees are commonplace. players are allowed to tackle the opposition with only slight restriction on how/where they can tackle. at the same time, players can often mess up the move they are to make, and it can result in an injury to themselves or others. all who play understand any/all risks, and yet still play the sport.


I would imagine that there would be have to be some form of insurance in place and thus specific rules and legal ramifications. Who is responsible for player welfare/safety and was that person derelict in their duty? If so, then the person responsible could be charged for negligence. If not, then the club's insurance can cover for any medical costs incurred by the injury (if applicable).

clubs have insurance, so players are covered for on field injuries - but that doesnt cover bruising et al (of course). if a player gets injured during the course of this sport, one of the following will happen:
- the player will play on, as they dont believe it will hamper them greatly, and will deal with it post match
- the player will alert the bench and will come off the ground
- the player needs assistance, and will be helped off the ground by one or two club trainers
- the player is unable to move without pain, or is knocked out, and the moment the umpires are told, the game will stop, while a stretcher is brought out.

of the above, the play only stops for the last point. why? thats just the way the game is, and always has been played.

in stls case, he had played a scintillating 1st half (though knowing him he is probably talking out of his arse :p). from there, the other team employed a player to stick with him at all times to reduce his impact on the game. this generally also involves physical niggling to annoy stl and break his concentration. sure stl may be a bit bruised up after the game, but stl would have expected some of the attention coming his way. and besides, the game has been played like this for many many years, even in the top flight - and the only reason why the pros have eased up recently is due to the heavy fines they receive when caught, and also due to the 576 cameras in the stadiums that tape the match, meaning nothing is unseen anymore


If it's the latter, then it falls under third party public liability, which means that the player who knocked out the other player is at fault.

i wish this perception could be removed from the world completely, because 99% of the times when this happens it is an accident, and i feel for anyone who is sued when it happens



That's how it works in martial arts anyway, so I'd imagine it would be the same for other sports too.

apples and oranges cant be compared :)


George

[MV75]

I'd run them over in the parking lot.
________
7 (http://www.toyota-wiki.com/wiki/Toyota_7)

[The_Damned]

I'd run them over in the parking lot.

:eek: